This helps me reframe an issue I'm grappling mightily with: "Our actual enemies are the people who are lying, not the people who bought those lies." I'm pondering. Thank you for the work you do.
I also hope that the good that did exist during the previous administration will allow some light into the thinking of Trump followers, in order for them to begin to question the “truths” that have been espoused but not come to fruition. We need to be ready to help clarify and right the ship.
I like this framing a lot, but it rests on the premise that most Americans are "good," i.e. they want to see people treated fairly, that meritocracy is the norm, that the rule of law is the rule of the land. But do they, really? I know I'm still in the grief/despair phase of our current situation, and my cynicism and misanthropy are at an all time high. But suppose things go south with the economy and the "price of eggs," the supposed drivers of the election...will his supporters really say, we made a big mistake? They seem to be fine with a lot of horrifying stuff, none of it a surprise since he made it clear what he intended to do before he was elected. Sorry for being so dark. I applaud you for seeing the Dunkirk-ness of the moment. We all have to live in hope, after all.
I think a lot of people are willing to rationalize evil if it means egg prices go down, not just in America but in general, which is unfortunate and something we'll have to deal with as human beings forever
I also think that these supporters have been fed a pack of lies about why their lives suck, they think it's immigrants and DEI and etc. A lot of what we're seeing is misdirected rage that by rights should focus on the oligarchs consolidating wealth and power at the expense of basically everyone. If we can help even a fraction of Trump voters understand this, our position changes dramatically
You absolutely know more about this than I do. I haven't lived in a place that wasn't a hyperblue city in a blue state in over a decade. I grew up among catholic republicans, and I changed, but only because I realized that I was actually trans and queer. Without that, I don't see any way I ever would have left. That was the crack through which everything ended up flowing for me, but it was a crack that was already there inside of me. What about people who can't have those lived experiences? Because for me, being socially left came long before being economically left. Do other people go the other way?
Besides all of this, it's just so easy for me to imagine any sort of mental contortion. Well, not any sort. Just the same sort over and over again: "That didn't happen." Once you have a reality-denying nuke like that in your arsenal, there's nothing that can ever defeat it. I don't see any way through. So as a person who knows a lot more about this than I do, what do you see that I don't?
I agree that it has to be some kind of personal experience, and the ones that are identity-based are the most powerful. But it can also be something that happens to someone you love, or a sense of deep personal betrayal. I've heard a lot of stories of people who changed their opinion on abortion restrictions when they saw someone they know and love suffer from it. Incredibly inefficient way to do things and requires suffering! Not good! But possible.
A massive economic crisis and a sense of deep betrayal will feel real personal to everyone, and that's what gives me hope.
I'm not gonna lie, it took me YEARS to go from Objectivist to where I am now, and it was helped a lot by a personal tragedy that I'll probably end up talking about someday. That's shitty because we really don't have years, but world events move faster now and we can only work with what we have
There's my rambling answer, for whatever it's worth -- also, congrats on breaking free, I don't think that's ever easy, no matter how wide the crack is
One of the many ways social media hurts us is by making the truly horrible people appear to be the majority of people who voted for Trump. But the many Trump voters are people who remember 2016-19 as better than 2021-23. (I know those dates leave things out, but I think that's how many evaluate the difference.) These will the easiest to reach.
The majority of Trump voters probably do think immigrants are stealing their jobs, inner cities are wastelands, and the poor deserve to be poor because they are lazy. They will be harder to reach, but when hard times come, there will be opportunity. A consistent refrain of, "No one with less power than you is ruining your life. Look at the oligarchs who have power," will eventually break through.
The hardest part is going to be protecting human rights while changing the subject to the power of oligarchs. We can't compromise on the rights of people being attacked, but the whole point of the attacks on LGBTQ+ and immigrants is to divide us and keep the conversation away from those with actual power. If we can only fight to protect human rights, we are having the fight that the oligarchs want. I don't think there's an easy answer, but we should at least know it's a problem.
In the meantime, the Democratic Party needs to be remade. God bless Nancy Pelosi, but that generation is well past its sell by date. Time for new faces and new leaders.
I understand feeling that way but don't agree. 2016 felt like a fluke and there was massive cultural resistance. He destroyed a bunch of norms and values that paved the way for this current assault, but aside from the tax cut didn't actually do very much policy-wise
The Dunkirk analogy works for me. I’ve found that the people that were lied to are just not that interested on politics or civil affairs. They just want to watch their favorite TV shows and go along with the crowd they hang with. Finding ways to tell them the truth and give some permission to think for themselves sound like good strategy. Thanks for your writing!
I don't really know what I think about Elon Musk but I have a question for you and your readers. Do you think that Elon Musk's gesture was inspired by an affinity for the the moral and political values and philosophy of Nazi's?
I think Elon Musk is doing that obnoxious 2015 4Chan thing where it's a joke unless you don't want it to be a joke but stop freaking out about it tho but seriously "They" are conspiring to cause wildfires and poison the blood of our country
He's boosted Alex Jones. He's boosted the appearance of a guy on Tucker Carlson's little show who asserted that Churchill, not Hitler, was the villain of WWII. In 2023 he responded to a tweet that read "Jewish communties have been pushing the exact kind of dialectical hatred against whites that they claim to want people to stop using against them" with, and I quote, "you have said the actual truth."
Does he consider himself a Nazi? I don't know and I don't care. What I do know is that he did the straight-arm fascist salute twice, complete with the striking of the chest: a motion that actual goddamn Nazis are very excited about right now. He has not denied that this was his intent. There are no good reasons to do that on a national stage in a moment of victory. Zero.
This helps me reframe an issue I'm grappling mightily with: "Our actual enemies are the people who are lying, not the people who bought those lies." I'm pondering. Thank you for the work you do.
I also hope that the good that did exist during the previous administration will allow some light into the thinking of Trump followers, in order for them to begin to question the “truths” that have been espoused but not come to fruition. We need to be ready to help clarify and right the ship.
I like this framing a lot, but it rests on the premise that most Americans are "good," i.e. they want to see people treated fairly, that meritocracy is the norm, that the rule of law is the rule of the land. But do they, really? I know I'm still in the grief/despair phase of our current situation, and my cynicism and misanthropy are at an all time high. But suppose things go south with the economy and the "price of eggs," the supposed drivers of the election...will his supporters really say, we made a big mistake? They seem to be fine with a lot of horrifying stuff, none of it a surprise since he made it clear what he intended to do before he was elected. Sorry for being so dark. I applaud you for seeing the Dunkirk-ness of the moment. We all have to live in hope, after all.
I think a lot of people are willing to rationalize evil if it means egg prices go down, not just in America but in general, which is unfortunate and something we'll have to deal with as human beings forever
I also think that these supporters have been fed a pack of lies about why their lives suck, they think it's immigrants and DEI and etc. A lot of what we're seeing is misdirected rage that by rights should focus on the oligarchs consolidating wealth and power at the expense of basically everyone. If we can help even a fraction of Trump voters understand this, our position changes dramatically
This is exactly where I'm at - well said as usual!
You absolutely know more about this than I do. I haven't lived in a place that wasn't a hyperblue city in a blue state in over a decade. I grew up among catholic republicans, and I changed, but only because I realized that I was actually trans and queer. Without that, I don't see any way I ever would have left. That was the crack through which everything ended up flowing for me, but it was a crack that was already there inside of me. What about people who can't have those lived experiences? Because for me, being socially left came long before being economically left. Do other people go the other way?
Besides all of this, it's just so easy for me to imagine any sort of mental contortion. Well, not any sort. Just the same sort over and over again: "That didn't happen." Once you have a reality-denying nuke like that in your arsenal, there's nothing that can ever defeat it. I don't see any way through. So as a person who knows a lot more about this than I do, what do you see that I don't?
I agree that it has to be some kind of personal experience, and the ones that are identity-based are the most powerful. But it can also be something that happens to someone you love, or a sense of deep personal betrayal. I've heard a lot of stories of people who changed their opinion on abortion restrictions when they saw someone they know and love suffer from it. Incredibly inefficient way to do things and requires suffering! Not good! But possible.
A massive economic crisis and a sense of deep betrayal will feel real personal to everyone, and that's what gives me hope.
I'm not gonna lie, it took me YEARS to go from Objectivist to where I am now, and it was helped a lot by a personal tragedy that I'll probably end up talking about someday. That's shitty because we really don't have years, but world events move faster now and we can only work with what we have
There's my rambling answer, for whatever it's worth -- also, congrats on breaking free, I don't think that's ever easy, no matter how wide the crack is
Well said, as always.
One of the many ways social media hurts us is by making the truly horrible people appear to be the majority of people who voted for Trump. But the many Trump voters are people who remember 2016-19 as better than 2021-23. (I know those dates leave things out, but I think that's how many evaluate the difference.) These will the easiest to reach.
The majority of Trump voters probably do think immigrants are stealing their jobs, inner cities are wastelands, and the poor deserve to be poor because they are lazy. They will be harder to reach, but when hard times come, there will be opportunity. A consistent refrain of, "No one with less power than you is ruining your life. Look at the oligarchs who have power," will eventually break through.
The hardest part is going to be protecting human rights while changing the subject to the power of oligarchs. We can't compromise on the rights of people being attacked, but the whole point of the attacks on LGBTQ+ and immigrants is to divide us and keep the conversation away from those with actual power. If we can only fight to protect human rights, we are having the fight that the oligarchs want. I don't think there's an easy answer, but we should at least know it's a problem.
In the meantime, the Democratic Party needs to be remade. God bless Nancy Pelosi, but that generation is well past its sell by date. Time for new faces and new leaders.
Agree, agree, agree
I feel like Dunkirk was 2016, they've made it up the Thames now.
I understand feeling that way but don't agree. 2016 felt like a fluke and there was massive cultural resistance. He destroyed a bunch of norms and values that paved the way for this current assault, but aside from the tax cut didn't actually do very much policy-wise
He's sure doing stuff now
Either way we're in a bad spot
The Dunkirk analogy works for me. I’ve found that the people that were lied to are just not that interested on politics or civil affairs. They just want to watch their favorite TV shows and go along with the crowd they hang with. Finding ways to tell them the truth and give some permission to think for themselves sound like good strategy. Thanks for your writing!
I don't really know what I think about Elon Musk but I have a question for you and your readers. Do you think that Elon Musk's gesture was inspired by an affinity for the the moral and political values and philosophy of Nazi's?
I think Elon Musk is doing that obnoxious 2015 4Chan thing where it's a joke unless you don't want it to be a joke but stop freaking out about it tho but seriously "They" are conspiring to cause wildfires and poison the blood of our country
He's boosted Alex Jones. He's boosted the appearance of a guy on Tucker Carlson's little show who asserted that Churchill, not Hitler, was the villain of WWII. In 2023 he responded to a tweet that read "Jewish communties have been pushing the exact kind of dialectical hatred against whites that they claim to want people to stop using against them" with, and I quote, "you have said the actual truth."
Does he consider himself a Nazi? I don't know and I don't care. What I do know is that he did the straight-arm fascist salute twice, complete with the striking of the chest: a motion that actual goddamn Nazis are very excited about right now. He has not denied that this was his intent. There are no good reasons to do that on a national stage in a moment of victory. Zero.
I'm sorry my answer wasn't what you wanted, but it's not going to change or get less nuanced for you